Gen. Wesley Clark is Likely to Run

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http://www.draftclark2004.com/news_detail.asp?nid=100

Expect a formal announcement around Labor Day. Clark is perfectly positioned an an ultra-weak field. It's clear that this is a large contingency out there that is uncomfortable with Bush yet is uninterested in any of the Dem candidates. Clark has the persona and message to break through.

And I don't think it's too late. In fact I think he may benefit from not having his message lost in the clutter of the current candidates. He will be the first fresh face in months. He has the resume and credentials to challenge Bsh on Iraq and foreign polciy and he's clearly willing to do so.

Some think he won't have the organization to run, but he really has an organization already in place with all of the internet sites that have organized, formed headquarters, has chapters in 42 states and is running ads in NH and Iowa. The organization is already in place to ramp up once he announces. He also will get plenty of push from CNN where he was an analyst. I'm sure they would love it if one of their own made a strong run. He will definitely garner some serious headlines around Labor Day and around the time when the debates begin.

I'm telling you guys, Clark can win the nomination, and of all of the candidates I think he has the best chance of actually beating Bush if he should win the nomination.

I expect nobosy to take this seriously, but just remember in a few months that I told you Clark would be a serious contender by Nov. 1.
 

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They need somebody. The collection of garbage they have running now doesnt stand a chance. I thought Bush was dumb until I heard some of these guys talk. Dean is one of the few that has a brain but is too liberal. The rest are ****ing idiots
 

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Bumpity bump.
It will be official in less than 2 weeks. You heard it here first: WES CLARK IS GOING TO WIN THE DEM NOMINATION. I'm dead serious. Let's not forget that Clinton didn't enter the race until October of '91. It is not too late for Clark and in fact I think it was a smart strategic move (if it was that) to wait until later to make a splash after the othes have failed to interest many.

The fact is that there are A LOT of people -- dems, independents and even repubs -- who are not comfortable with this Admin but are not interested in someone like Dean or Kerry. Clark brings a lot to the table and will give Bush and his handlers nightmares.

The race is wide open and Clark is going to be in the top 3 in the polls by Nov. 1. You heard it here first.

I wonder what kind of odds I could get on Clark right now. Anyone know if any book has a 'field' bet on the dem nomination?

WESLEY CLARK is going to be the next President of the United States.
 

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has been on CNN all day giving his agenda. I appreciate the news but it is not exactly breaking. I hope he does get the nomination BTW.

wil.
 

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Today? Cool, didn't even know that. To my knowledge, he hasn't announced yet. He's basically said that he will announce one way or another around Labor Day. Party insiders seem convinced he will throw his hat in the ring. I for one am excited! Wat do you think wil, do you agree with me that he has a good shot?
 

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did a nice interview with him a couple of hours ago on his show. As far as his chances go, its is a little to early to tell, I hope to hear more on the later political news tonight.

wil.
 

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GREAT. JUST GREAT!

Im no genius.
but all you need in the middle of a national crisis, is some military nut, cloaking himself in the clothes of the good to SUDDENLY APPEAR on the scene.

you are meant to be the most advanced and smartest nation in the world.....

How about this. You fukking prove it.


Ok, I've had a drink and Im going to shout.

AN ADVANCED NATION NEVER ALLOWS AN ARMY GUY TO ENTER HIGH OFFICE!

ONLY A THIRD WORLD SHITHOLE LETS THESE GUYS IN TO RUN THEIR COUNTRY!

rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
icon_mad.gif
icon_mad.gif


I dont care if his intentions are 'good'.

He's Army. He's out.

[This message was edited by eek on August 22, 2003 at 08:07 PM.]
 

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Do names like George Washington, Andrew Jackson, U.S. Grant, Theodore Rossevelt, and Dwight D. Eisenhower ring any bells. They should, they were all generals who became presidents. Try to get a clue before you spew your anti-American crap.

wil.
 

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Its got nothing to do with anti anyone you goddam muppet.

YOU DO NOT LET THE MILITARY RUN A DEMOCRACY.

THEY ARE NOT UP TO THE JOB.

Get a dodgy civilian to do the job, like GWB.

Anti-american??????

PRO-DEMOCRACY!!

KEEP THE MILITARY AWAY!!

WELL AWAY!!

Only the crap third world dungholes employ the military in domestic high office.

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Thanks for your expert and as we all can see well informed opinion. Do yourself a favor and read a little history.


wil. BTW. whats a muppet?
 

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Great stuff.

First you invade a country that the entire world doesn't want you to.

Then you want to elect a squarehead to sort things out...


You really need someone with a brain, and common sense, like Bill Clinton, to appear, and soon.
What about Powell?
He seems to have a brain that functions.
 

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Dwight D. Eisenhower

Bringing to the Presidency his prestige as commanding general of the victorious forces in Europe during World War II, Dwight D. Eisenhower obtained a truce in Korea and worked incessantly during his two terms to ease the tensions of the Cold War. He pursued the moderate policies of "Modern Republicanism," pointing out as he left office, "America is today the strongest, most influential, and most productive nation in the world."

Theodore Roosevelt, during the Spanish-American War, Roosevelt was lieutenant colonel of the Rough Rider Regiment, which he led on a charge at the battle of San Juan. He was one of the most conspicuous heroes of the war.

Andrew Jackson, A major general in the War of 1812, Jackson became a national hero when he defeated the British at New Orleans.

George Washington: When the Second Continental Congress assembled in Philadelphia in May 1775, Washington, one of the Virginia delegates, was elected Commander in Chief of the Continental Army. On July 3, 1775, at Cambridge, Massachusetts, he took command of his ill-trained troops and embarked upon a war that was to last six grueling years.

He realized early that the best strategy was to harass the British. He reported to Congress, "we should on all Occasions avoid a general Action, or put anything to the Risque, unless compelled by a necessity, into which we ought never to be drawn." Ensuing battles saw him fall back slowly, then strike unexpectedly. Finally in 1781 with the aid of French allies--he forced the surrender of Cornwallis at Yorktown.

U.S. Grant, Lincoln appointed him General-in-Chief in March 1864. Grant directed Sherman to drive through the South while he himself, with the Army of the Potomac, pinned down Gen. Robert E. Lee's Army of Northern Virginia.

Finally, on April 9, 1865, at Appomattox Court House, Lee surrendered. Grant wrote out magnanimous terms of surrender that would prevent treason trials.

wil.
 

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THE MARSHALL PLAN (1947)
On June 5, 1947, Secretary of State George C. Marshall spoke at Harvard University and outlined what would become known as the Marshall Plan. Europe, still devastated by the war, had just survived one of the worst winters on record. The nations of Europe had nothing to sell for hard currency, and the democratic socialist governments in most countries were unwilling to adopt the draconian proposals for recovery advocated by old-line classical economists. Something had to be done, both for humanitarian reasons and also to stop the potential spread of communism westward.

The United States offered up to $20 billion for relief, but only if the European nations could get together and draw up a rational plan on how they would use the aid. For the first time, they would have to act as a single economic unit; they would have to cooperate with each other. Marshall also offered aid to the Soviet Union and its allies in eastern Europe, but Stalin denounced the program as a trick and refused to participate. The Russian rejection probably made passage of the measure through Congress possible.

The Marshall Plan, it should be noted, benefited the American economy as well. The money would be used to buy goods from the United States, and they had to be shipped across the Atlantic on American merchant vessels. But it worked. By 1953 the United States had pumped in $13 billion, and Europe was standing on its feet again. Moreover, the Plan included West Germany, which was thus reintegrated into the European community. (The aid was all economic; it did not include military aid until after the Korean War.)

Aside from helping to put Europe back on its feet, the Marshall Plan led to the Schuman Plan, which in turn led to Euratom, then the Coal and Iron Community and the Common Market, and pointed to what may yet evolve into an economically and politically united Europe. In many ways, the Marshall Plan satisfied both those who wanted our foreign policy to be generous and idealistic and those who demanded realpolitik; it helped feed the starving and shelter the homeless, and at the same time stopped the spread of communism and put the European economy back on its feet.

For further reading: John Gimbel, The Origins of the Marshall Plan (1976); Imanuel Wexler, The Marshall Plan Revisited (1983); Michael Hogan, The Marshall Plan (1987).


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THE MARSHALL PLAN
I need not tell you gentlemen that the world situation is very serious. That must be apparent to all intelligent people. I think one difficulty is that the problem is one of such enormous complexity that the very mass of facts presented to the public by press and radio make it exceedingly difficult for the man in the street to reach a clear appraisement of the situation. Furthermore, the people of this country are distant from the troubled areas of the earth and it is hard for them to comprehend the plight and consequent reaction of the long-suffering peoples, and the effect of those reactions on their governments in connection with our efforts to promote peace in the world.

In considering the requirements for the rehabilitation of Europe the physical loss of life, the visible destruction of cities, factories, mines, and railroads was correctly estimated, but it has become obvious during recent months that this visible destruction was probably less serious than the dislocation of the entire fabric of European economy. For the past 10 years conditions have been highly abnormal. The feverish maintenance of the war effort engulfed all aspects of national economics. Machinery has fallen into disrepair or is entirely obsolete. Under the arbitrary and destructive Nazi rule, virtually every possible enterprise was geared into the German war machine. Long-standing commercial ties, private institutions, banks, insurance companies and shipping companies disappeared, through the loss of capital, absorption through nationalization or by simple destruction. In many countries, confidence in the local currency has been severely shaken. The breakdown of the business structure of Europe during the war was complete. Recovery has been seriously retarded by the fact that 2 years after the close of hostilities a peace settlement with Germany and Austria has not been agreed upon. But even given a more prompt solution of these difficult problems, the rehabilitation of the economic structure of Europe quite evidently will require a much longer time and greater effort than had been foreseen.

There is a phase of this matter which is both interesting and serious. The farmer has always produced the foodstuffs to exchange with the city dweller for the other necessities of life. This division of labor is the basis of modern civilization. At the present time it is threatened with breakdown. The town and city industries are not producing adequate goods to exchange with the food-producing farmer. Raw materials and fuel are in short supply. Machinery is lacking or worn out. The farmer or the peasant cannot find the goods for sale which he desires to purchase. So the sale of his farm produce for money which he cannot use seems to him unprofitable transaction. He, therefore, has withdrawn many fields from crop cultivation and is using them for grazing. He feeds more grain to stock and finds for himself and his family an ample supply of food, however short he may be on clothing and the other ordinary gadgets of civilization. Meanwhile people in the cities are short of food and fuel. So the governments are forced to use their foreign money and credits to procure these necessities abroad. This process exhausts funds which are urgently needed for reconstruction. Thus a very serious situation is rapidly developing which bodes no good for the world. The modern system of the division of labor upon which the exchange of products is based is in danger of breaking down.

The truth of the matter is that Europe's requirements for the next 3 or 4 years of foreign food and other essential products -- principally from America -- are so much greater than her present ability to pay that she must have substantial additional help, or face economic, social, and political deterioration of a very grave character.

The remedy lies in breaking the vicious circle and restoring the confidence of the European people in the economic future of their own countries and of Europe as a whole. The manufacturer and the farmer throughout wide areas must be able and willing to exchange their products for currencies the continuing value of which is not open to question.

Aside from the demoralizing effect on the world at large and the possibilities of disturbances arising as a result of the desperation of the people concerned, the consequences to the economy of the United States should be apparent to all. It is logical that the United States should do whatever it is able to do to assist in the return of normal economic health in the world, without which there can be no political stability and no assured peace. Our policy is directed not against any country or doctrine but against hunger, poverty, desperation, and chaos. Its purpose should be the revival of working economy in the world so as to permit the emergence of political and social conditions in which free institutions can exist. Such assistance, I am convinced, must not be on a piecemeal basis as various crises develop. Any assistance that this Government may render in the future should provide a cure rather than a mere palliative. Any government that is willing to assist in the task of recovery will find full cooperation, I am sure, on the part of the United States Government. Any government which maneuvers to block the recovery of other countries cannot expect help from us. Furthermore, governments, political parties, or groups which seek to perpetuate human misery in order to profit therefrom politically or otherwise will encounter the opposition of the United States.

It is already evident that, before the United States Government can proceed much further in its efforts to alleviate the situation and help start the European world on its way to recovery, there must be some agreement among the countries of Europe as to the requirements of the situation and the part those countries themselves will take in order to give proper effect to whatever action might be undertaken by this Government. It would be neither fitting nor efficacious for this Government to undertake to draw up unilaterally a program designed to place Europe on its feet economically. This is the business of the Europeans. The initiative, I think, must come from Europe. The role of this country should consist of friendly aid in the drafting of a European program so far as it may be practical for us to do so. The program should be a joint one, agreed to by a number, if not all European nations.

An essential part of any successful action on the part of the United States is an understanding on the part of the people of America of the character of the problem and the remedies to be applied. Political passion and prejudice should have no part. With foresight, and a willingness on the part of our people to face up to the vast responsibilities which history has clearly placed upon our country, the difficulties I have outlined can and will be overcome.

Source: Congressional Record, 30 June 1947

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George C. Marshall was a General of the Army during WWII.
Marshall become head of the War Department's War Plans Division and then deputy chief of staff (1938-39), prior to being selected by Franklin D. Roosevelt to be army chief of staff (1939-45). Highly regarded by his peers, leaders of the Roosevelt administration, and members of Congress, Marshall was in charge of getting the U.S. Army and Army Air Corps ready for war (1939-41), reorganizing the army (1942), and leading it throughout the war. He was the most important member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and, according to Winston Churchill, the organizer of Allied victory.

Another great American General.

wil.
 

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Great periods in modern history.

But none of that is relevant at the moment.
(but what was done was exceptional)

Things have moved on, and a long way on.

Its changed, and the solutions are different, and the people are different.

Its not even like Japan after WW2.(McArthur)


They dont want you.
You support Israel. Period.

Untill you dont support Israel, forget about it.
 

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What does that have to do with ex-generals running for president? EEK have you ever been in the military? Do you know anything about Duty, Honor, Country? You seem to be sterotyping all military men. If I understand you correctly, once a general always an idiot, is this your thinking?

wil.
 

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my point.
(WW2 was a very reasonable(and irrelevant for the present day) exception.)

YOU DO NOT LET THE MILITARY RUN A DEMOCRACY.

THEY ARE NOT UP TO THE JOB.

Get a dodgy civilian to do the job, like GWB.

Anti-american??????

PRO-DEMOCRACY!!

KEEP THE MILITARY AWAY!!

WELL AWAY!!

Only the crap third world dungholes employ the military in domestic high office.

...was my point.
===========================================

You should not even CONSIDER the military as civilian leaders.

And the military, if they respect their country, should not ever consider themselves as potential candidates for civilian high office.

All the aforementioned people above were brought to the fore in extremely exceptional circumstances.

I notice you didn't include Gen McArthur.
icon_wink.gif


[This message was edited by eek on August 22, 2003 at 09:09 PM.]
 

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eek, and Wil's cogent point is that we've had 5 military men as Presidents and each did a distinguished job. There's a pretty good track record there. Clark is a very intelligent and honorable man with sensible generally moderate ideas. He'd make an ideal Prez at this time IMHO.
 

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For one thing MacArthur never was president. I thought that was your problem. Wesley Clark happened to at one time be a general, well known for his prominent roll in the Gulf War. He is now retired and a civilian. Whatever his politics may be, just the fact that he ws once a general does not make him some kind of lunatic. He may just be the right man for the job. Can you say for certain that he is not. Of course you can't. Just as I cannot say he is. The guy has decided to run for president of the US. To put it mildly he is a longshot, but he does have the right to run.

wil.
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by eek:
my point.

And the military, if they respect their country, should not ever consider themselves as potential candidates for civilian high office.

All the aforementioned people above were brought to the fore in extremely exceptional circumstances.

I notice you didn't include Gen McArthur.
icon_wink.gif


[This message was edited by eek on August 22, 2003 at 09:09 PM.]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

eek....hello! McArthur was not President! And I don't know about you but I'd say the current circumstances are as "exceptional" as ever!
 

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